Nero tag created when making minimal change to M4A file with chapters

[markf]

I have an M4A file created in ffmpeg that has chapters in it. I load the file into mp3tag and that shows the file has only MP4 tags i.e. it displays MP4 (MP4) in the Tag column.

I change the Artist field because the name is incorrect, and I save the tag.

Now the Tag field displays MP4 (MP4 Nero).

Looking at the file with a hex editor I see that the Chapter information has moved (it used to be near the beginning of the file) ffmoeg (and foobar2000) shows that the Chapters are still there.

No additional tags have been added. Why are there Nero tags added, and what could possibly be in them? and, of course, can I get rid of them if they weren't needed to start with?

[markf]

Additional test on the same starting file:
I used ffmpeg -map_chapters -1 to remove the chapter information when making a copy, and then make the same change to the tags.

The Tag field still displays MP4 (MP4). In other words, the Nero tags are NOT added if there is NO chapter information, and the Nero tags ARE added if there IS chapter information.

Is there any way to suppress the addition of the Nero tags? Clearly they aren't necessary in this file, and it is only the presence of chapter information that triggers their creation when editing the existing MP4 tags.

[ohrenkino]

Here is a thread on chapter generation:

Request: Option to disable auto MP4 chapter generation

Would it be possible to have an option to disable the MP4 chpl chapter generation (mentioned in your comment here) introduced with v2.92? It's very minor, but it means my media player (MPC-HC) now shows Title Song Name Chapter Song Name (1/1) Artist Artist Name in its info box instead of just the title and artist lines. Of course, the chapters are easily removed with "Strip MP4 chapters" context option, but not adding them on file save would be more convenient for my use case.

Don't know, whether it helps. though.

[MotleyG]

@Florian Can you elaborate on this?

Request: Option to disable auto MP4 chapter generation

I've changed this behavior with Mp3tag v2.93a, so that no chpl atom is created automatically if Apple gapless data is found. Thanks for bringing this to my attention!

By "Apple gapless data" are you referencing the legacy ITUNESGAPLESS pgap field that needs to be set to 1? While I don't believe current versions of iTunes specifically uses this any longer, it can still be used and set in mp3tag if that is what is required for keeping the chapters from getting generated.

In the case of the OP's concern, is the indication of "MP4 NERO" just a change of format based on how mp3tag handles chapters in m4a? I don't think there are other specific tags added, just the format change, correct?

[Florian]

@markf

the Nero tags are NOT added if there is NO chapter information, and the Nero tags ARE added if there IS chapter information.

Yes, this is how it's implemented at the moment. I went that route to be most compatible with foobar2000, which is using a similar approach (at least at the time). It's basically a representation of the chapters in Nero form — your original chapters are still there.

@markf

Is there any way to suppress the addition of the Nero tags?

No, it's currently not possible.

@MotleyG

By "Apple gapless data" are you referencing the legacy ITUNESGAPLESS pgap field that needs to be set to 1?

This was a different issue that has been fixed with v2.93a. Back then, Mp3tag created the chpl atom in that case no matter if chapters were present or not.

[2019-01-29] CHG: chpl atom was created if Apple gapless data was present. (#44323)

@MotleyG

In the case of the OP's concern, is the indication of "MP4 NERO" just a change of format based on how mp3tag handles chapters in m4a? I don't think there are other specific tags added, just the format change, correct?

It's an addition of the Nero representation. No change of the existing format.