Incorrect filename order of playlist on pendrives

Hi,
This is a strange one so I'm not sure if this is a PC setting or mp3tag setting.
When I have a folder of mp3 files on the desktop & create a playlist the list is generated in alphanumeric order.
If that folder is copied to a pen drive and mp3tag is asked to generate the playlist the order is not alphanumeric.
I'm not sure what order the files are in, as it is not by date or size as far as I can tell.
This is probably best illustrated by an example:

  • Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn; located on pendrive gives the following playlist:
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 03 - In Dulci Jubilo.mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 04 - First Excursion.mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 06 - Portsmouth.mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 01 - Ommadawn Part One (2010 Stereo Mix By Mike Oldfield).mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 02 - Ommadawn Part Two - On Horseback (2010 Stereo Mix By Mike Oldfield).mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 05 - Argiers.mp3

  • Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn; (same folder) located on desktop:
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 01 - Ommadawn Part One (2010 Stereo Mix By Mike Oldfield).mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 02 - Ommadawn Part Two - On Horseback (2010 Stereo Mix By Mike Oldfield).mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 03 - In Dulci Jubilo.mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 04 - First Excursion.mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 05 - Argiers.mp3
    Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 06 - Portsmouth.mp3

For comparison here is the Dir output from a cmd prompt:
Directory of C:\Users\xxxxx\Desktop\Ommadawn 2010-5326762 Album

29/04/2015 15:10 .
29/04/2015 15:10 ..
16/06/2012 12:57 46,135,052 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 01 - Ommadawn Part One (2010 Stereo Mix By Mike Oldfield).mp3
16/06/2012 12:56 42,086,117 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 02 - Ommadawn Part Two - On Horseback (2010 Stereo Mix By Mike Oldfield).mp3
16/06/2012 12:50 7,183,254 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 03 - In Dulci Jubilo.mp3
16/06/2012 12:57 14,477,687 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 04 - First Excursion.mp3
10/06/2012 22:20 9,871,753 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 05 - Argiers.mp3
10/06/2012 22:47 5,131,060 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 06 - Portsmouth.mp3
29/04/2015 15:09 793 _Ommadawn 2010-5326762 Album.m3u

Any idea what is going on here?
OS is Win 8.1; The pen drive it Bitlocker encrypted (as is the OS partition) & is set to 'trust' the pen drive so automatically unlocks the drive when connected.
The fact that mp3tag writes the playlist means that this shouldn't be an issue.

Anyone come across this issue before?
Many thanks
Stellar

Usually MP3tag generates a playlist (which is a text file) in exactly that order as the files appear in the files list.
You can actually rearrange entries in the files list manually to get a different order.
So: please check what the sort criteria are when you read files from the thumb drive.

I cannot remember having such a case on my machines.
But I am curious about the usbstick/pendrive, ...
with which file system has the drive been formatted (NTFS, FAT32, ... ???)

And ... check out what user 'ohrenkino' has mentioned ...
make sure in Mp3tag user interface, listview columns, sort option ...
which column is set to be sorted, ...
when loading a set of files from folder view, or by drag and drop, or by playlist file.

DD.20150429.1824.CEST

I have re-created your test example, and there is a difference in the DOS sorted output, ...
have a look to this output text ...

2015-04-30 12:37 .
2015-04-30  12:37    <DIR>          ..
2015-04-29  17:52               538 _Ommadawn 2010-5326762 Album.m3u
2012-06-16  12:57                 5 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 01 - Ommadawn Part One (2010 Stereo Mix By Mike Oldfield).mp3
2012-06-16  12:56                 5 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 02 - Ommadawn Part Two - On Horseback (2010 Stereo Mix By Mike Oldfield).mp3
2012-06-16  12:50                 5 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 03 - In Dulci Jubilo.mp3
2012-06-16  12:57                 5 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 04 - First Excursion.mp3
2012-06-10  22:20                 5 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 05 - Argiers.mp3
2012-06-10  22:47                 5 Mike Oldfield - Ommadawn (2010) - 06 - Portsmouth.mp3
<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->

... the filename with the leading underline character ...
is sorted into the first position of the filelist, ...
and this is expected standard behaviour.

In your DOS output example ...
this filename is sorted at the end of the filelist.
Do you have an explanation for this special case?

DD.20150430.1257.CEST

Hi Guys,
Thanks for the replies. Apologies, I've been away on hols :slight_smile:

You can actually rearrange entries in the files list manually to get a different order.
So: please check what the sort criteria are when you read files from the thumb drive.

I'm not changing anything in terms of sort criteria on mp3tag for either directory nor DOS, so they should be the same?
Re-arranging files manually is what I'm trying to avoid.

make sure in Mp3tag user interface, listview columns, sort option ...
I use the default sort view when the application opens

which column is set to be sorted, ...
none, I just open the application & they are normally sorted by filename

when loading a set of files from folder view, or by drag and drop, or by playlist file.
Context menu against a folder to launch mp3tag

mp3tag normally orders files in by filename, but I have never (knowingly) had to specifically request it. When it launches it just orders by filename, I presume this is either 'learned' behaviour from previously running the programme or default operation.

However, now I have just checked again & when I launch mp3tag against the folder located on the desktop the files are automatically ordered by filename.
When I now launch mp3tag against the folder on the pend drive, the files are not ordered by filename.
They are listed in application in the order of the playlist - i.e. 03, 04, 06, 01, 02, 05
So why does the application list them differently depending on what drive they are located on?

with which file system has the drive been formatted (NTFS, FAT32, ... ???)
60GB pen drive formatted at exFAT; BitLocker encrypted (so is my OS drive)

H'mm, so this just got a bit weirder. I have other directories of music on this pen drive & some appear to have
a random order to the files when first listed in mp3tag; whilst others order by filename...

Right - so looking closer at the application I can see that the columns are actually sorted by the column titled 'Cover' - way out to the right which is why I missed it earlier.
I don't understand what the secondary sort criteria mp3tag is using as all the mp3 files have cover art embedded.

Needless to say, if I switch back to sort by filename, close the application & then launch again the files are listed correctly & playlists are generated in filename order.
What was throwing me was the different behaviour of mp3tag depending on whether the directory was located on the desktop or on the pen drive (even though it was sorted by 'Cover' I would have expected the same behaviour in both locations)
I still find that weird, but at least I know now how to get the results I want.
thanks for your support :slight_smile:
Stellar

It is not possible within Mp3tag list view to have no sort setting.
Please check again, which column header contains the triangle up/down sort symbol?

DD.20150506.1359.CEST

If you can reproduce this behaviour at any time, then it could be worth to have a closer look to the exFAT file searching method.

DD.20150506.1415.CEST

Hi,

It is not possible within Mp3tag list view to have no sort setting.
Please check again, which column header contains the triangle up/down sort symbol?
I already commented that the filter option was set to 'Cover', but this was right out to the right so wasn't immediately obvious.
However ALL the files have cover art so this entry is a 1 for all files. Given that, how does mp3tag sort the files?

If you can reproduce this behaviour at any time, then it could be worth to have a closer look to the exFAT file searching method.
I can reproduce this anytime & every time for different directories on the pen drive. Some order alphanumerically & some don't.
All files have embedded album art so this field is always a 1. However, I don't understand what your asking :frowning:
" have a closer look to the exFAT file searching method"
What does this mean?

Thanks
Stellar

If the sort criteria does not really lead to a properly sorted sequence then mp3tag takes the files in what ever sequence the request is answered by the file system.
If you watch Windows explorer copy a longer list of files following a drag&drop with the mouse, then you will notice that WE first copies the file that was under the mouse cursor when the action was triggered and then works along the list of files.
And this sequence is later returned by the file system if not other requests overrule it...
So, if you set the sorting column back to "filename", you will probably get better results.

I do not understand, how is some filter option involved when sorting?

I have no experience with the exFAT filesystem, but what I read about, ...
it says that the technical method to search for or to locate a file in the file system, ...
works by a new method by using upcased letters, simply said.
And because you have shown a directory list example, ...
which has sorted a filename with a leading underline character "" to the end of the file list, ...
I suspect some weird or unknown behaviour (at least to me ...) by the exFAT filesystem, ...
because a filename with a leading underline character "
" ...
in general will be sorted to the top of the list of filenames, when the names are alphabetically sorted.

DD.20150506.2141.CEST