Mp3tag BPM Tag not recognized with VLC Media Player

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 6:08am

I did some tests with the BPM tag (TBPM) of Mp3tag, I noticed that it is not recognized in the VLC Media Player program:

The VLC Metadata detects the BPM Tag (BPM) of BSI Info Editor and does not detect the BPM TAG (TBPM) of Mp3tag, I am very surprised... Tests with Windows 7 and 10

But if I program a TBPM TAG (TBPM) with Mp3tag, the VLC Metadata recognizes it

The iTunes program on the other hand, does not detect the BPM Tag (BPM) of BSI Info Editor and detects the BPM TAG (TBPM) of Mp3tag

If I program a TBPM TAG (TBPM) with Mp3tag, iTunes does not recognize it

I placed the photos of my tests, with the BSI Info Editor (Simian) and Mp3tag programs, the data of the audio file, the BPM & TBPM Tags with Notepad++:
Tests for programs: VLC Medias Player & iTunes

I did an additional search on the Broadcast Software International website about the BSI Simian program, for the BPM TAG (BPM), this TAG is recognized by the Adobe Audition program

Following my tests and research, Florian, it would be good if Mp3tag, could have 2 BPM Tags:

BPM Tag
BPM Tag (TBPM)

I think that everything is possible with Mp3tag, these 2 tags, which could be compatible at the same time for VLC and iTunes programs, with the command, I think Actions (Quick) / Replace...

LyricsLover · December 20, 2024, 7:41am

Little addition:
The official tag name according the ID3-standard for "Beats per minutes" for MP3 is TBPM.
This is valid for ID3v2.3 and ID3v2.4:
https://id3.org/d3v2.3.0

  TBPM
   The 'BPM' frame contains the number of beats per minute in the
   mainpart of the audio. The BPM is an integer and represented as a
   numerical string.

The TXXX tag name BPM is a user-defined field. Everyone can create user-defined fields. The support for such user-defined fields highly depends on the target software or player.

Why VLC does not support the official TBPM is a question you should ask in the VLC forum.

MotleyG · December 20, 2024, 12:15pm

I don't see any reference from the OP about the file type. It would help to confirm that it is a mp3 file. I'm assuming it is based on having id3 metadata.

Florian · December 20, 2024, 12:18pm

The field name for the beats per minute in Mp3tag is BPM. For MP3 files, it's mapped to the official ID3v2 frame with the frame ID TBPM, this implies that any field with the name BPM is stored as a TBPM ID3v2 frame. This is documented here: Tag Field Mappings — BPM

Using TBPM as field name in Mp3tag is pointless, as it would create a user-defined TXXX frame using TBPM as field name.

VLC currently doesn't support the BPM field, i.e., it has no semantic understanding of what's inside a BPM field.

For a BPM field to be listed at VLC's additional metadata tab, it would need to be stored as user-defined TXXX frame with the name BPM. This is not possible with Mp3tag, because Mp3tag uses the standard TBPM frame to store the beats per minute in ID3v2 tags.

Florian · December 20, 2024, 12:23pm

It is, some screenshots reference Test Mp3 and the hex view from Notepad++ is showing excerpts of an ID3v2 tag.

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 2:15pm

Hello LyricsLover, as you already explained to me the BPM tag (BPM) is unofficial, I think it's great that the Adobe company recognizes this TAG

I wouldn't make a request on the VLC forum, not everyone uses Mp3tag, knowing that many of my Radio colleagues check the Metadata with the VLC Program because it is free and it is Open Source and I don't want the BPM TAG (BPM) to be replaced by the BPM tag (TBPM)...

The only thing that surprises me in the VLC program is why we can't modify the metadata, it's very surprising for an Open Source program...

LyricsLover · December 20, 2024, 2:19pm

Of course you can modifiy the (few) metadata directly in VLC.
Just type it in the existing fields and press the "Save" button in the lower right corner

WARNING:
Please be very careful. VLC writes ID3 metadata back as ID3v2.4(!)

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 2:22pm

Hello MotleyG, yes I confirm that my tests are done in MP3 - ID3v2.3 ISO-8859-1 with Mp3tag

ohrenkino · December 20, 2024, 2:24pm

Foobar2000 is also free and has far better tag handling.
(and BTW: MP3tag is also free - so why use a program that cannot cope with the standard tag field BPM?)

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 2:34pm

Hello ohrenkino, thanks for the info about this Foobar2000 program that I didn't know, it's good to know

We use Mp3tag, it does the job well to modify the Metadata...

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 2:41pm

I can't use ID3v2.4 tags(!), thanks for the warning, I've never edited with VLC

I knew that we could edit this page, but thanks for the information it's risky for me who works with ID3v2.3

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 3:24pm

Hello Florian, according to your explanations, VLC places in its Metadata, the BPM TAG (BPM), without knowing the data of this Tag, I understand...

I also understand that you want to follow the standards in force for ID3v2.3 BPM (TBPM) and etc...

I tell myself that if the Adobe company, which is a very innovative and world-renowned company, allows itself, deviate from standards ID3v2.3 by accepting the 2 tags BPM (BPM) and BPM (TBPM)

My question: Is it possible to program the BPM TAG (BPM) in Mp3tag?

ohrenkino · December 20, 2024, 3:29pm

As soon as MP3tag finds a user-defined field called BPM in a file, then this tag field is stored in the MP3tg internal field BPM or %bpm% and as soon as tag data is written back to the file, the contents of the internal %bpm% is written to the corresponding standard compliant field (if there is one).
And for %bpm% there is the standard field TBPM - so the user-defined field gets replaced with the standard field which is ignored by VLC.

LyricsLover · December 20, 2024, 5:31pm

Mp3tag also accepts, reads and shows both BPM tags.
The official TBPM and the TXXX:BPM too:

#file   01 test.mp3
#tag    ID3v2 3.0
{TBPM}
        321
{TXXX:BPM}
        456

Mp3tag shows them as:

But Mp3tag does not support "ignore the existing (ID3) standard".
Mp3tag only writes back the official TBPM.
In this specific case, Mp3tag combines the two values 321 and 456 and separate it only with NUL. Some software shows it later as:
[ID-TBPM] Beats Per Minute : 321/456

In a hex editor, it looks like this:

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 6:00pm

You are right ohrenkino, I had already done tests with Mp3tg internal field BPM and %bpm%, when saving it rewrites the BPM TAG (TBPM), I had written to Florian about this, I thought I could rewrite the BPM Tag (BPM), in summary, Mp3tag is not programmed to change the name of the TAG...

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 6:11pm

LyricsLover, I am surprised by your Test, the two values 321 and 456 and separate it only with NUL, in what you show me, there is no data that accompanies the BPM & TBPM and no TXXX?

Sergius · December 20, 2024, 6:34pm

LyricsLover, you were able by id3 and cmd to write the BPM TAG (BPM), which is a workaround to the rule, it is very appreciated and a big thank you...

This is my opinion, I believe that the MP3tag program is configured to program the BPM Tag (BPM), and the other BPM Tag (TBPM) at the same time, I am not 100% sure, it would be up to Floriant to write us on the subject...

poster · December 21, 2024, 8:35am

@Sergius
VLC does not support BPM in another way, it just does not support it at all. VLC only supports user-defined fields and simply shows any user-defined field you create.
So if it is important for you that VLC shows the content of a BPM-field, just give the field any other name. ie. MYBMP.
You can even tell Mp3Tag with the Mapping that it shall write the user-defined field MYBPM when a BPM-Field is saved.

LyricsLover · December 21, 2024, 10:52am

and

For those interested in the VLC source code:
vlc_meta.h
ID3Meta.h

There are some more metadata related modules like ID3Tag.h, ID3Text.h, vlc_input_item.h and so on. None of them includes any hint about "Beats per minute", "BPM" or anything like that.

As Florian and poster already wrote:
VLC (up to the current version v3.0.21) knows nothing about BPM.
VLC reads most of the TXXX frames and does not care about their content and compliance with standards as with BPM.

Sergius · December 21, 2024, 2:38pm

=> As LyricsLover and Floriant and have already written:

Hello poster, I created for TEST the Tag MYBPM with Mp3tag, when reading the VLC, the Tag MYBPM appears in the metadata...

Mp3tag does not allow us to change, when saving, example: the Tag MYBPM in Tag BPM and or the Tag BPM (TBPM) in Tag BPM (BPM)

I express my opinion, I believe that Floriant could create a Tag BPM (BPM) with Mp3tag, as Lyrics Lover, already wrote to me this Tag is unofficial, but I believe that it is used by some programs and recognized by the Adobe Audition program...